Mr. Holder knew about Fast and Furious months before he testified (under oath) and did nothing to stop the program until a border agent showed up dead. Maybe he wasn't criminally negligent, but it was absolutely gross incompetence/negligence.
Will: Holder sure shows Obama's "Heck of a Job, Brownie" moment.... politically-damaging loyalty to an unqualified incompetent crony who is on over his head.
"Chicago politics" is shorthand for "corrupt", which is a charge "Rational" Nation has no proof of.
Just as dmarks has no evidence to suggest Holder is incompetent.
Also, what's the evidence that Holder lied? And the border agent being killed has nothing to do with Fast and Furious, except that they had serial numbers from two of the guns the drug smugglers used in their records.
Them having the serial numbers only proves they were suspicious of the purchasers... but were prevented from stopping them by the prosecutors who said nothing illegal was going on.
Weak gun laws pushed by the NRA and their Republican lackeys are responsible for Brian Terry's death, not Fast and Furious or Holder.
MANY MANY more guns than those which the Fast and Furious agents recorded the serial numbers of are flowing into Mexico. Significantly more. Fast and Furious having been ended does not mean the flow of guns has stopped. I guess your feelings on this are that the ATF shouldn't even try to stop these guns?
wd, I agree with you that we need more effective gun control laws (the fact that people can still buy guns at gun shows without background checks is appalling) but 2 wrongs still don't make a right and the fact that the ATF allowed 2,000 HIGH POWERED weapons into Mexico and into the hands of some of the most vicious human beings on the face of the earth is something that should never happen again.......As for Mr. Holder, if he isn't lying, then he doesn't read his memos and that doesn't make me feel all that confident, either. I really think that he should step aside and maybe put a guy like Senator Webb in there (I think that he's a lawyer).
They didn't allow them. I believe the Fortune magazine article. The version of events you believe doesn't make sense. Why would they allow the guns to cross the border if they had no way of tracking them? Were they planning on using divination magics? These agents would have to be profoundly stupid. I just don't find your version of events believable.
The Fortune article is wrong. Gun dealers constantly asked (and I provided you with one of the emails) for reassurance from this Voth idiot that the guns that they were selling to these KNOWN straw purchasers would not end up in criminal hands and each time this Voth idiot responded with a lie. And the fucking ATF has admitted that they let the guns walk and that was one of the reasons why the frigging acting director stepped down. Come on, wd.
He's worse than incompetent. He's a party stooge, forgetting about justice completely a lot of the time.
As in his efforts fighting for election fraud, by preventing states from removing fake voters from lists and also Holder's efforts to gut other programs to stop election fraud.
11 comments:
Gonzales resigned, Holder will not. Because there was actual wrongdoing by the Justice Department under Gonzales, unlike with Holder.
Mr. Holder knew about Fast and Furious months before he testified (under oath) and did nothing to stop the program until a border agent showed up dead. Maybe he wasn't criminally negligent, but it was absolutely gross incompetence/negligence.
Will: Holder sure shows Obama's "Heck of a Job, Brownie" moment.... politically-damaging loyalty to an unqualified incompetent crony who is on over his head.
Chicago political politics playing out the national stage.
On the national stage.
Somewhere between John Mitchell and Elliot Richardson...
"Chicago politics" is shorthand for "corrupt", which is a charge "Rational" Nation has no proof of.
Just as dmarks has no evidence to suggest Holder is incompetent.
Also, what's the evidence that Holder lied? And the border agent being killed has nothing to do with Fast and Furious, except that they had serial numbers from two of the guns the drug smugglers used in their records.
Them having the serial numbers only proves they were suspicious of the purchasers... but were prevented from stopping them by the prosecutors who said nothing illegal was going on.
Weak gun laws pushed by the NRA and their Republican lackeys are responsible for Brian Terry's death, not Fast and Furious or Holder.
MANY MANY more guns than those which the Fast and Furious agents recorded the serial numbers of are flowing into Mexico. Significantly more. Fast and Furious having been ended does not mean the flow of guns has stopped. I guess your feelings on this are that the ATF shouldn't even try to stop these guns?
wd, I agree with you that we need more effective gun control laws (the fact that people can still buy guns at gun shows without background checks is appalling) but 2 wrongs still don't make a right and the fact that the ATF allowed 2,000 HIGH POWERED weapons into Mexico and into the hands of some of the most vicious human beings on the face of the earth is something that should never happen again.......As for Mr. Holder, if he isn't lying, then he doesn't read his memos and that doesn't make me feel all that confident, either. I really think that he should step aside and maybe put a guy like Senator Webb in there (I think that he's a lawyer).
They didn't allow them. I believe the Fortune magazine article. The version of events you believe doesn't make sense. Why would they allow the guns to cross the border if they had no way of tracking them? Were they planning on using divination magics? These agents would have to be profoundly stupid. I just don't find your version of events believable.
The Fortune article is wrong. Gun dealers constantly asked (and I provided you with one of the emails) for reassurance from this Voth idiot that the guns that they were selling to these KNOWN straw purchasers would not end up in criminal hands and each time this Voth idiot responded with a lie. And the fucking ATF has admitted that they let the guns walk and that was one of the reasons why the frigging acting director stepped down. Come on, wd.
He's worse than incompetent. He's a party stooge, forgetting about justice completely a lot of the time.
As in his efforts fighting for election fraud, by preventing states from removing fake voters from lists and also Holder's efforts to gut other programs to stop election fraud.
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